Articles Where Are They Now - Day Four Cast?

When Lois interrupted the meeting in Downing Street, she expected Torchwood to send the 456 packing. but sometimes when you go into things like Flynn, you wind up making the biggest mistake of your life. Not every alien creature is going to run and hide because you utter the word TORCHWOOD. Perhaps if the 456 had heard of the name The Doctor, it might have considered the consequences of its actions. Except, the Doctor never turns up in Torchwood, does he?  

When Jack and Ianto reached the 'penthouse suite' in Thames House, harbouring the 456 in its gas chamber, they weren't expecting the tables to suddenly turn and for them to face death along with the office staff currently clamouring at the exits, desperate to escape.

So, how many children are we giving up to this alien threat?

Deborah Findlay

‘Denise Riley’

'Now look, on the one hand you've got the good schools. And I don't just mean those producing graduates, I mean the pupils who will go on to staff our hospitals, our offices, our factories. The workforce of the future. We need them. Accepted, yes? So, set against that you've got the failing schools, full of the less able, the less socially useful. Those destined to spend a lifetime on benefits, occupying places on the dole queue and, frankly, the prisons. Now look, should we treat them equally? God knows, we've tried, and we've failed. And now the time has come to choose. And if we can't identify the lowest achieving ten percent of this country's children, then what are the school league tables for?'

A member of the government, Denise was quite vocal regarding the 456 and Prime Minister Green's approach to it. She came into herself more in the 5th episode, and surprised us all with her clear insight into the way Green had handled the situation, putting Frobisher into the firing line and thus ending his own life and that of his family. But nevertheless, as a politician, she sat at that table and discussed, with all of them, which children they could afford to give up to an alien race.

Since Torchwood, Findlay has played Miss Tomkinson in Cranford from 2007 - 2009, Mary Carter and Gemma King in Silent Witness from 2003 - 2010, Rowena Drake in Poirot in 2010. Was the voice of Sophia Tolstoy in The Trouble with Tolstoy in 2011. Played Philippa Pawlowski in Holby City a year later. Played Vanessa in Leaving in the same year. In Coriolanus for National Theatre Live played Volumnia in 2014.

Played Lorna Soane and Hilary Richards in Midsomer Murders from 2000 - 2015. Was Pauline in Lady in the Van in 2015. More recently played Eleanor Shaw in Collateral in 2018, and is currently in The Split as Ruth from 2018 - 2020.

Nicholas Briggs

‘Rick Yates’

'I'm just saying, if we need to spin this to the public, and God knows, at the moment, spin is all we can do, then in an age when we're terrified by the planet's dwindling resources, a reduction in the population could possibly, just possibly, if presented in the right way, be seen as good. Sir.'

Yates is another member of the current government. No family. No kids and no worries about sending a bunch of children off to their fate. 

It would be exceptionally difficult to list all of Briggs' credits, given that they are mostly if not all, connected in some way to Doctor Who and Torchwood, through the BBC and Big Finish. As you already know, Briggs is the voice behind the Daleks, Cybermen and Judoon. He has lent his voice to video games from Doctor Who to Lego Dimensions as the characters he vocally portrays on the telly.

If we were to list every single role and character that Briggs has played and voiced since he took up the reins of Dalek voice etc, it would be like listing Captain Jack's back catalogue of relationships. We'd be here till the sun explodes!!!

So instead, we can categorically say that Briggs has been involved in the Whoniverse from acting, directing, producing and composing since 1998 and is still going strong now, with Big Finish and the new series of Doctor Who, voicing Dalek's, Judoon and Cybermen for the 13th Doctor seasons.

We had the opportunity of interviewing Nicholas Briggs a couple of years ago and you can find it in our Interview section.

Patrice Naiambana

‘Defence Secretary’

'If the criteria we use is demonstrably fair and entirely random, then at least we could defend ourselves.'

He rallied the 'troops' around the political table to secure the figures for how many children would be sacrificed to the 456.

Since Torchwood, Patrice has voiced characters for Tinga Tinga Tales for 37 episodes from 2011 - 2012, played George Maynard and Tony in Casualty from 2005 - 2010. Been the voice of Luke the Sight Neuron for Nina and the Neurons in 2013 - 2015. Was the voice of King Pancake in 101 Dalmation Street in 2019.

Sophie Hunter

‘Venessa’

'According to our alien friends, in four months time, the virus will mutate. It's a brand new strain of Indonesian Flu. They claim it could kill up to twenty five million people. All our research seems to back up their figures. In 1918, the Spanish Flu outbreak killed something like five percent of the human race.'

One of the 1965 military who was assassinated by the government many years later, to hide the details pertaining to the 456. Venessa gave Jack Harkness the job of finding and offering up 12 children to the 456 for an antidote for the Indonesian Flu.

Hunter’s acting credits appear to fizzle out on IMDB after 2010, leaving a huge gap in her acting career. Yet after much research and some interesting discoveries, Sophie is not just an actress, but an English avant-garde theatre, opera director and playwright. After 2010, it seems her acting career took a step behind the camera.

Hunter began her acting credits in the two episodes of Children of Earth in 2009. Since then she went on to play roles in Short Films, from Woman in the Meadow in 2010, a Witch in the Great Performances play Macbeth and Maria in another short again in 2010.

Hunter co-founded the Lacuna Theatre Company and was associate director for the Royal Court Theatre in the West End of London and the Broadhurst Theatre in Broadway for the play Enron in 2010. Hunter has directed and performed in theatres across Europe, the Middle East and North America. She has directed experimental plays such as 69 degrees South in 2013, a New York City play called Lucretia in 2011 and the 2010 revival of Henrik Ibsen's Ghosts.

As well as directing, Hunter has also been involved in music, recording a French language music album called The Isis Project with Guy Chambers in 2005, releasing an English Language EP called Songs for a Boy, again with Chambers, six years later. In 2010, Hunter worked with Armin van Buuren for the song 'Virtual Friend' which was added to Buuren's 2010 Mirage album.

Was artistic director for Tesla in New York, a concert performance in 2013.

The most interesting piece of research was to discover that Sophie Hunter married Sherlock star Benedict Cumberbatch on 14th February, 2015 at St Peter and St Paul Church on the Isle of Wight. They have two children, Christopher Carlton born June 2015 and Hal Auden born March 2017.

In that same year, Hunter was producer of Megan Hunter's dystopian novel 'The End We Start From' with her husband and Adam Ackland's production company Sunnymarch, along with Liza Marshall's Hera Productions.

Alan Bond

(Uncredited) ‘UNIT Soldier’

Bond’s acting credits also begin with Torchwood COE episodes for Days 4 & 5. Since then he has played various uncredited and credited roles including 5 episodes of The Bill from 1996 - 2010, George in Paco's Men from 2008 - 2010, for 10 episodes. Was a plain clothed policeman in Law & Order: UK from 2009 - 2013. Was a parent at the Swimming Gala in Bad Education in 2013. Played several different characters for Casualty from 2008 - 2013.

Played another parent in Outnumbered in 2014. In 2015 played a Defendant's Solicitor uncredited in Broadchurch. Played Yann's solicitor in Marcella in 2016. Played a Presenter for Bond's Millions from 2012 - 2017 for 10 episodes. In 2018, played a Golf Course Manager for Rosamunde Pilcher television series.

For films was an uncredited German Officer for The Monuments Men in 2014.

Big Finish Reviews+ Unbound: Exile by Tony J Fyler

‘Oh no she isn’t!’ cries Tony.

The Big Finish Unbound series exists precisely to explore non-canonical ideas – what if the Doctor and Susan had never left Gallifrey? What if the Valeyard had won at the end of The Trial of a Time Lord?

One of the most experimental of the Unbound series, Exile plays Doctor Who for straight-up pantomime laughs, posing the question of what would happen if the Doctor escaped before sentencing at the end of The War Games, and never got exiled to Earth looking like Jon Pertwee.

Before there was a female Master, before we’d seen male-to-female regeneration on-screen, it also toyed with the much bigger sub-heading, What if the Doctor became a woman?

In a staggering example of prescience, all the way back in 2003, it was Arabella Weir who got to be the first full-adventure female Doctor (Joanna Lumley only appearing in the final moments of Curse of the Fatal Death four years earlier), bringing along her flatmate and fellow actor to play one of the Time Lords who did the sentencing and who subsequently chased her down. Some young skinny chap, name of Tennant…

Weir’s Unbound Doctor works in Sainsbury’s, on Earth, and gets drunk pretty much every night with her pals, Cherrie (Hannah Smith) and Cheese (Jeremy James). She puts her sonic screwdriver to work getting pound coins out of trolleys and for the most part spends her time trying, with appallingly little success, to blend in.

Meanwhile, Time Lords Toby Longworth and David Tennant are despatched to Earth to hunt her down and bring her back to bally well stand trial.

There are very few moments of any seriousness in Nicholas Briggs’ script – which is exactly what you’d expect of a Panto Who. Tennant’s reaction to being told that the Doctor has escaped – ‘Oh, shit!’ – is just one in a long line of gags undermining the Time Lords and their terminal worthiness. If you told Robert Holmes to just go completely hog-wild and took the brakes off him in The Deadly Assassin, you’d have Exile. Time Lords who just want to sit around all day in robes and headdresses, signing the occasional document are the order of the day.

Out of all of which comes a ladette Doctor, replete with vomit and hangover gags as she tries to blend into the local culture of turn-of-the-Millennium Britain. But – at the risk of taking a panto Who way too seriously – there is some characterisation underneath it all. She’s a Doctor who’s come about by suicide (in a line that will delight all the Missy-hating, ‘the Doctor should never be female’ fans, in the world of Exile, Time Lords only change sex when they commit suicide), and part of the reason she drinks so much is not to blend in, but to forget all the potential she has, to make herself right with the Doctor she’s become.

She’s a Doctor essentially in a crisis of self-identity – knowing that the reason she came to Earth was to hide, and so if she does anything ‘Doctory’ she’ll give herself away, but increasingly throughout the course of the story simply desperate to do something Doctory – tackling a bloke in the pub because he looks a bit ‘Mastery,’ reacting to the ultra-lame plan of the Time Lords pretending to be the ‘Rubber-Mask People’ (we mentioned this was Doctor Who as pantomime, right?) and, most tellingly of all, believing the psychological projection of the ‘other Doctor,’ the one she used to be, when he tells her about the evil plot of the Quarks to blow up the Sainsbury’s car park and destroy Princess Anne on the grounds that she ‘might one day be Prime Minister, or President of the Earth or something’ – she absolutely craves the Doctor she used to be, and resents what she’s been forced to become, claiming with good reason that the Time Lords want to punish her for being herself, and that herself isn’t a bad thing to be.

Ultimately, the call of the Doctor is too strong for her to ignore, or drown under lager and vodka any longer, and in trying to get back to her Tardis and fly away, she gives the Time Lords the heads-up they need to capture her. And even when put under ‘house arrest’ in the Tardis for rubbing the Time Lords’ noses in her ability to evade their justice, she feels that itch, that need to be free, to be the wanderer, the righter of wrongs, the Doctor. When she believes that activating the Tardis will wipe her out of history forever, she still flicks the switches, rationalising to herself that it might be better to be the Doctor one last time than live out her life forever wandering the Tardis corridors. The Exile Doctor is the Doctor trying always to self-discipline, when she doesn’t believe she’s done anything to deserve it. She’s the Doctor grown wilful and stubborn, without the intercession of the Time Lords to force her into her exile on Earth. In a sense, Exile shows us something telling about the human (and Time Lord) condition – it’s much easier to endure a punishment if you feel it’s been imposed on you than it is to govern yourself. It’s a fundamental truth, and it’s odd to find it in a pantomime version of a science-fiction show, but the reason we have laws and punishments is because the act of self-governance is not inherent in us, and likewise, a child getting away with a misdemeanour will find it more difficult and more meaningless to pay a voluntary penance for that misdemeanour than they would find it to sit on the naughty step under the cruel tyranny of a parent for a while.

The Exile Doctor is a Doctor who evades Time Lord justice, only to find the hoops she has to jump through to stay off their radar are worse than their judgment would have been. It’s a journey that ends with her making a rash decision, believing herself to be safe, and only thinking it through a half-second too late.

Briggs and Weir together create a version of the Doctor who’s almost unrecognisable in the pack, but who still manages, beneath an awful lot of vomit and headache jokes, to teach us something about the Doctors we’ve actually had, and the nature of our species. It’s perhaps fitting that she’s probably closest in her outlook to the Tenth Doctor, who, freeing himself completely of the baggage of the Time War, became the Time Lord Victorious. Weir never takes the Exile Doctor into quite such dark waters – she’s captured before any such crisis of personality can engulf her. But in having the cleverness to evade punishment, she finds her own cage in the life she’s forced to live on Earth, and retains the wilful streak right to the end. The Exile Doctor is unconquerable, determined not to submit to Time Lord justice – but in the end, her refusal to submit to their punishment is her undoing, both in terms of what she’s forced to become, and the lack of thought she puts into her final escape. 

Big Finish Reviews+ Doctor Who: The Exxilons by Jeffrey Zyra

By Nicholas Briggs

Starring Tom Baker and

Louise Jameson

Planet E9874 is a peaceful planet that is not technology advanced and is the home of the Tarl.  The Locoyuns who are peaceful and more advanced in technology are helping the Tarl get past the Stone Age by helping them develop rudimentary technology.  But are they or is it a plan for something else?  The Doctor, Leela and K–9 discover that things are not what they seem.  Further to the point Leela discovers an ancient power of unimaginable strength, an ancient power that The Doctor has encountered before, that threatens to take over the minds of everyone on Planet E9874.

While I was listening to this one it did not occur to me that this was a prequel/sequel to Death of the Daleks.  Even when looking at the CD case it never dawned on me even with Exxilons starring me right in the face.  It finally clicked when I heard the familiar sound of the tower from the City of the Exxilons.  That’s how my winter has gone that I totally zoned out on that fact and my mind was on other things for such an easy Classic Who reference to be missed by me.   So with that it was quite the pleasant surprise that it turned out that the Exxilons were connected to The Death of the Daleks.   All good and all but was The Exxilons a good story? 

Well it was good but it wasn’t great.  It was your average primitive civilization taking on a more advanced group of visitors to its planet that ends up tricking them into their bidding in this case building the obelisk that can take over the minds of the population.  You probably know how this story ends with The Doctor helping the Tarl to overcome their oppressors The Locoyuns.  Pretty simple and something we have seen and heard before.  If anything even though The Exxilons weren’t all that original it was pretty entertaining and I did like how it tied into Death to the Daleks.  That part was really interesting as you got a sense of what the Exxilons were like and what motivated them to make that city in the first place.   

While The Exxilons was an average adventure it is good to hear Tom Baker, Louise Jameson and John Leeson reprise their roles of The 4th Doctor, Leela and K–9 and it is always good to hear more audio adventures from that era because as time goes by there won’t be many more adventures with this crew to enjoy.  So if you want an entertaining story to listen to while you go on a drive or while working on the computer then The Exxilons isn’t a bad one to listen to.

Grade C+

Interviews Nicholas Briggs by DJ Forrest

Firstly I wanted to say hello and thank you for the interview.

Where did your love of science fiction begin, and as a child were you always the quiet one busy reading the many magazines, comics and books, a mind full of imagination, whisking yourself off on many adventures in your head, or were you into other things as a child?

Nick: I don’t think I was often that quiet. Mind you, I did used to beaver away writing stories and drawing my own comic book adventures from a pretty young age. My two main obsessions were war stories and Doctor Who. I also used to love Thunderbirds and all the Gerry Anderson series, Lost in Space, Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea, Land of the Giants and Tarzan. I was pretty noisy, acting out all these things. Running round with toy guns, playing with toy Daleks, trying to get the whole school to play Doctor Who and the Daleks… that worked on a few, mad memorable occasions: the whole school running around, it seemed, with half of them being scared humans and the other half holding arms stiffly out in front, screaming, ‘Exterminate!’. It probably wasn’t the whole school… it just felt like it was.

Had you always been interested in writing, or did you have another career choice before you settled to the career you have, and how many jobs have you taken before you reached this point and what were they?

Nick: I’ve always been interested in stories. So, as a kid, writing them down seemed just a part of acting them out and telling them. I also used to record my own stories on tape, often improvising all the characters. Crazy, really. I spent ages mucking about with tape recorders and making sound effects too. As for career choices, I went to drama school to train to be an actor at the age of 18. I had a great training and got a degree in Theatre Arts. But it was a long old struggle getting to where I am now. Much of it extremely enjoyable, but with plenty of poverty along the way. I got diverted into publishing and PR for a while, but I was always, relentlessly, finding ways of writing and acting throughout.

Although I’m not suggesting that your parents were also proud voices of Daleks but are you following in your parents footsteps with regards to writing or were you inspired by another and if so, who?

Nick: My parents had nothing to do with entertainment. My late father worked in the motor industry most of his life and also loved boats. My mother did a lot of secretarial work, but also trained in first aid and was a school nurse right up until her retirement. Both of them were always good storytellers, though. My Mum still will tell me a good tale about the old days or about something that’s happened to her in her life recently. My brother has been a broadcaster, producer and newsreader for many years, though. He works for the BBC in Newcastle.

You’ve provided the voices for a good many alien creatures over the years, but how many alien creatures have you provided the voices for?

Nick: Oh, I’ve no idea. You can count them, surely!

Roy Skelton and Royce Mills were the voices of the Daleks prior to 2005. When Russell T Davies brought back Who the voice of the Daleks was so much different, it had tone and each Dalek had a different ‘voice’ as it were.  How did the role come about and how, when you’ve got a multitude of Dalek voices to deal with, do you remember which voice you need for each gold/bronze Dalek, and the Cult of Skaro?

Nick: It’s part of the acting job of doing Dalek voices to remember which ones go with which Daleks. I got the job because I’d been doing Dalek voices for Big Finish for about five years. And I’d written an article about Dalek voices in DWM. Russell listened to the Big Finish audios and liked my Dalek voice. He also saw from the DWM article that I knew how they were created technically, so he saw me as a total solution. 

Which era of the Doctor is your favourite and why?

Nick: I don’t really do favourites. Patrick Troughton is my favourite Doctor and I would die happy if they found Evil of the Daleks. But I really do love all of them. I suppose the ones who were on when I was younger have a more special place in my heart. It’s been particularly brilliant to work with Tom Baker on the Big Finish stories in recent years. But I also very much admire Peter, Colin and Sylvester – and Paul. They all have such enthusiasm and affection for the role and they’re all really lovely to work with.

Not only do you provide the voice for the Daleks but you also co-wrote a book about them “The Dalek Survival Guide (ISBN 0-563-48600-7) published by BBC Books in 2002.  Which is your favourite Dalek and were you seated behind the sofa with the rest of us during Doctor Who or were you brave and sat ON the sofa during the programme?  What was the first episode of Who that you remember growing up and who would have been YOUR Doctor?

Nick: Loads of questions sneaked into that one. In order… My favourite Dalek? I like the Emperor in Evil of the Daleks. When I was a kid, I used to get very scared of Doctor Who, but would never stop watching. If my Mum thought it was scary, she would put the newspaper in front of my face until she thought the scary bit was over. I have a lot of newsprint memories! I’m not quite sure which was my first Doctor Who episode. It was certainly in the last William Hartnell series. I remember The Tenth Planet quite well. But I also have some memories of The Celestial Toymaker. I remember also being very upset that William Hartnell was leaving.

Which has been your favourite Dalek to provide the voice for? I liked the Cult of Skaro, each Dalek appeared to have a different tone to their voice.

Nick: So hard to judge. There’s always a challenge. But I suppose the greatest challenge was the first one in the episode entitled Dalek. Even though I always have a great time on set, you can’t really beat your first experience. It was truly a wonderful job to get. I never stop thanking Russell!

When you’re not working, how do you shut off from everything and chill, or are you always busy writing and planning for the next event, schedule etc?

Nick: You’ve put your finger on my big problem. I find it very hard to relax, because in so many ways, much of my work doesn’t feel like work, because it’s stuff I love. But, of course, all the schedules and planning is proper, hard, grown-up work. But whenever I try to relax, I find myself writing a story or piddling around with sound effects and music. My main form of relaxing is going out for a meal with my wife and son. Walking on the beach or watching a movie. I love old black and white war movies.

Overall what are your top 5 favourite villains?

Nick: Daleks, Cybermen, Ice Warriors, Zygons, Silurians.

Do you visit many of the Conventions and will you be at any events this year that we can find you at? 

Nick: I often go to conventions. I’m having a bit of a rest from them at the moment, because although all the attention is lovely in so many ways, it’s also a bit stressful. The way some people get very cross if you don’t have time to give an autograph is really quite stressful. I guess it’s my duty to sign things, so I shouldn’t grumble. I can’t remember where I’m going to events this year.

Are you involved in any new projects that you can share with us?

Nick: I’m writing some lovely stories for Tom Baker at the moment. I’m also working on the music for the Charlotte Pollard series for Big Finish. Charlotte Pollard was our first Eighth Doctor companion. She’s brilliant and is getting her own series. I’m also doing the music for Survivors and Counter-Measures. And there are other scripts in the pipeline. It never stops, I’m pleased to say.

When you’re on a break with your family do you hope nobody will recognise you or are you quite happy to be asked for autographs and photographs while you’re sunning yourself on the beach or mid way through a meal? (I’ve often wondered if people groan when they see a bunch of people nudge each other and point in the direction of the celebrity and quickly locate all the exit points)

Nick: I don’t mind if people are polite. No, it’s a thrill. Don’t mind that at all. I think I’d mind if I was relentlessly followed around. But let’s face it, that really isn’t likely to happen. 

You run Big Finish how did that opportunity come about and how many audio dramas have you been involved in, and how many have you made for Big Finish?  How many genres do you cover?

Nick: I’m the executive producer, along with Jason Haigh-Ellery, who owns the company. Paul Spragg is our production assistant and part of the team, David Richardson is the line producer. We all run it together, with loads of other people here, too numerous to mention. I couldn’t begin to tell you what we do. There’s too much. Just go to bigfinish.com and discover the great stuff we do.

Sherlock Holmes is a really interesting character, what is your favourite story written by Sir Arthur Conan Doyle?

Nick: I never know which one to choose. The Final Problem?

What was the last book you read?

Nick: I never have time to read books these days. I’m too busy writing. Isn’t that odd? I can’t remember the last book I read. I did read Any Human Heart by William Boyd, which is amazing. Actually, I think the last book I read was AE Van Vogt’s War Against the Rull. I love that. True space opera. I’d read it when I was a teenager and lost the book. So I ordered it on Amazon and re-read it, mostly in the bath.

If you were ever able to meet your 12 year old self what advice would you give him?

Nick: Don’t be so scared.

The role of Yates in Torchwood Children of Earth seemed quite a cold character, no family ties; it was just a business deal.  Politics!  Do you enjoy playing these types of characters, or are you comfortable playing any?  Which is your favourite role to date?

Nick: I’ll play anything anyone wants me to play, within reason, if it’s well written. I’ve loved so many parts I’ve played, particularly Sherlock Holmes. But I also loved playing Larry in Closer.

With the new season of Doctor Who currently in production, will you be involved in the new series and will you be providing all the voices for the creatures?

Nick: I can neither confirm nor deny any involvement in the new series.

What has been the most challenging role you’ve played?

Nick: Probably Larry in Closer. It’s a play about dysfunctional relationships and is full of really harrowing stuff. Not suitable for kids and that’s for sure. But it was a great, if emotionally exhausting, experience.

Questions from fans

Denise Amparo: If there will be a crossover of DW and any sci-fi film, which film would it be and which of the characters you voice will you bring and why?

Nick: I love The Andromeda Strain. But I can’t think of any voices I’d do in that.

Pauline Howard: You have done so many alien voices in Dr who I wondered if you had a favourite and why?

Nick: My favourite is the Daleks, because they are, in their own stunted way, very expressive. It’s also very therapeutic, getting out all that hatred. I also like the fact that most people find Dalek voices thrilling. They always get a good reaction on set and at the read-through.

Mickie Newton: How did it feel to be offered a role in Torchwood where you would be seen as well as heard?  Out of all the voices you have done for Doctor Who, which has been the most challenging?  Which do you most enjoy acting to the camera or sat behind the camera only using your voice?

Nick: It was great to get the part in Torchwood. But I have spent most of my acting career being seen, on stage. It was fun. The most challenging voice is the Cyberman, because it has no emotion, so it’s always a struggle to get anything interesting into it. The Daleks are also a challenge, because they’re so exhausting! At the moment, I’d say I most enjoy acting with my voice or in theatre. But I’d love to have the chance to do more acting for the camera. I’ve done more that just Torchwood. I’ve been in a couple of movies and done some other television and video stuff. Yeah, I’d like to do more.

Echo Fain As an executive producer at Big Finish, do you have any hopes of seeing a line of Torchwood audio plays in the near future?

Nick: I’d love it if we could do that. Let’s keep our fingers crossed.

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